Flynn
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Often imitated; Never Duplicated
Posts: 45
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Post by Flynn on Oct 11, 2003 15:42:14 GMT -5
Ok, lets pretend I am stupid.....Wait, when it comes to EMS, I am stupid. What is the criteria to "fly the bird", both from the County following protocol (what is it?) and from field units requesting it? Also.. What is the criteria you all use to cancel it when its on standby for a response? Please, please set me straight here! Ignorantly yours! Tim
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911Mom
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Welcome to the real world!
Posts: 60
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Post by 911Mom on Oct 11, 2003 17:08:03 GMT -5
When Stat came out to our 4th of July to do a PR, they stated that they would fly anything-medical or trauma. This is in direct contrast to what Guthrie would fly. For Guthrie to fly a medical they had to get medical command before they would even think about flying a medical. The Stat crew told us to think of them as an ALS unit in the sky. I guess the best way to put it is for any life threatening episode ie MVA, burns, hit by lightening. But if it is going to take longer for the bird to get onscene than it will to get to the hospital, they get recalled unless the patient is really FUBAR'd. At County, if the field units request the bird we contact them and put them on stand-by or tell them to fly. We then contact the fire department for that area and notify them so they can get the LZ set up. I hope this helped alittle
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Flynn
Full Member
Often imitated; Never Duplicated
Posts: 45
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Post by Flynn on Oct 11, 2003 18:42:16 GMT -5
Mother Dearest; That helps a little bit, at least a somewhat better understanding. I know I will never, well almost never, fly the bird. I probably will when I see someone smashed into a dash with an extended extrication, you know real impalement and what not. But I have been on crashes where I thought they should fly and haven't and also seen those where I have had to say "They are doing what? ". Also, every so often, we land the bird @ mountaineer park for a rendevous with a unit coming from Sullivan County. What prompts this, especially when a medical facility is only 4 miles more away? I am not "questioning" you all EMS people, but am questioning basically from being DUH? ? Throw me a bone on this will you! Tim
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Post by Matt Russell on Oct 11, 2003 19:33:33 GMT -5
Tim,
There are very few absolutes in EMS, it is mostly all gray. The choice to fly or not fly a patient falls into that gray area. There are certain factors that can and do play a role in the decision to utilize a helicopter or not.
TIME: As you well know time sometimes is and other times is not on your side or for this matter the patient's side. As Mama stated what is your eta to a hospital and lets take that one step further what is your eta to the MOST APPROPRIATE facility. Robert Packer Hospital is a Level 2 trauma Center in the state of PA (http://www.patraumasystemsfdn.com/pahmap_press2.htm) and is the closest trauma center around.
TRAUMA: Trauma is a disease of time (the golden hour)....these people many times need bright lights and cold steel to "fix" the damage. As above RPH is a trauma center and has the surgical teams in house 24 hours a day to "fix" the problem. They also have all the specialty people at the facility but, not necessarily in house 24-7. Geisinger is the next closest that meets Trauma Center Criteria. Towanda and Troy can and do handle minor to moderate trauma and in a pinch can stabilize a "nasty one" for further transport. Both these facilities usually - but not allways end up transfering the patient at some point to a trauma center so...why not send them there in the first place.
MEDICAL: Again as Mama stated STAT will fly medical patient's without medical command and as she stated, this is different to the service we knew best Guthrie One. STAT will fly anything - don't get me started. Even Fire Chief's (read further). Now what medical patient's do we fly? Again that depends on the time issue and what services the patient needs. I can tell you that in the Troy area if I am fortunate to resuscitate a cardiac arrest then I'm calling the bird....been there done that! or if they circleing the drain bad and I'm in Shunk and the bird could be in Canton when I get there.....probably gonna fly them too. it's 10 minutes from Canton - Troy (unless I'm driving) and it's 16 (give or take a couple minutes) by air to Sayre which is a "bigger / better" place so they say.
You made the right call with extended entrapment time...these paople are usually FUBAR and if you muck around they will be DRT.
The bottom line is ASSESS the patient and KNOW what's not right. You will fly some that don't need to but, you are erroring on their side.
Oh yeah the chief thing.....I was told by Kathi Hinrichsen (STAT 15 Outreach Coordinator) that STAT if requested will come to the scene of a search or forrest fire and give IC 30 minutes of flight time for size up / planning and more if justified - Talk about going verticle!
Hope this helps
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911Mom
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Welcome to the real world!
Posts: 60
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Post by 911Mom on Oct 11, 2003 23:41:24 GMT -5
The explanation that Western16 gave was perfect! I pay homage and tip my hat!! Thank you Matt!
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Medic21
Junior Member
Saving the world, One life at a time
Posts: 16
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Post by Medic21 on Oct 12, 2003 18:49:45 GMT -5
I couldn't have said it better myself!! But I would like to add that a helicopter is nothing more than an alternative means of transportation, so in the case of a large incident where our ground transportation resources are taxed or limited, I feel it would be appropriate to use the aircraft even if the patient's are not that critical.
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Post by canton1 on Oct 14, 2003 3:15:20 GMT -5
Timmy,
I can't believe you are shy on calling a helicopter. You are not shy calling any other apparatus. Call it, if it is not needed send it home. Better safe than sorry. If there is ever a question in my mind I get it going.
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