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Post by canton1 on Oct 2, 2003 5:59:30 GMT -5
Why do ambulances (especially Medic units) say they are responding when they are really not.
Is it that important to look good on paper!!!!!!
I am not sure---maybe Fire Wackers do this to, If they do shame on them tooooooo
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Medic21
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Saving the world, One life at a time
Posts: 16
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Post by Medic21 on Oct 2, 2003 17:41:54 GMT -5
Administration tells us to call enroute to avoid second dispatches and to cut response times on paper. Don't forget the "Medic" units are paid and stats are very important. Now do I think it's a great practice? No, but we all have to do what "the man" says once in a while when your paychek is at stake!!
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Post by Matt Russell on Oct 2, 2003 23:02:19 GMT -5
***Why do ambulances (especially Medic units) say they are responding when they are really not. ? Good question! I must agree with my young but respected colleague Barry. Might I also pose this to you...If a unit is dispatched and the crew is moving toward the unit and radios to county "responding" is this not true?
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3unit2
Junior Member
Posts: 24
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Post by 3unit2 on Oct 4, 2003 9:23:35 GMT -5
"Why do ambulances (especially Medic units) say they are responding when they are really not."?
Lets see what we have here so far.......... 1.Administration tells us to 2 to avoid second dispatches 3 to cut response times on paper 4 "Medic" units are paid 5 stats are very important 6 your paychek is at stake!! 7 Is this where pt. care goes in the list?
If a unit is dispatched and the crew is moving toward the unit and radios to county "responding" is this not true? The answer to this question is (crew members YES,ambulance NNNOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! )
Now for my thoughts and MY opinion ONLY........There are 2 sets of rules to play the same game..It depends on if you are ALS or BLS. One group can take 30 plus minutes to get on scene of a call,that is normally a 20 minute trip.The other group can not. One group,when on there third or fourth due call gets 10 minutes or more to get a crew or finally decide to have someone else dispatched. The other group can not..
Do I think it is right or fair?? NO.. Will it ever change?? Don't know..I hope so.
As for the post by Blueeighty8. That is a whole other story. Does it sound good,was it right,should it have happened? NO!!!!!!!!
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Medic21
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Saving the world, One life at a time
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Post by Medic21 on Oct 5, 2003 9:38:52 GMT -5
I can not speak for the volunteer agencies because we all know that you must respond from home and this takes a little time BUT as for the paid services, IF the crew is available and moving toward the truck I would have to agree with my Slightly older and very slightly wiser collegue Matt that we in a literal sense are "responding" to the call.
Now on the other hand if any service has only one crewmember available and is hoping that someone else is going to show up That might be an inappropriate time to call enroute.
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Post by chief322 on Oct 5, 2003 10:18:51 GMT -5
Since we are talking about responding off a portable, and heading for the rig, does this include taking time to take a squirt, comb the hair and/or finish a conversation? I know I've called responding off a portable and headed straight to the bathroom. Its a female dog when you get old! How about stopping at the Dandy or any fuel stop along the way to a structural call to fuel up? Is this really good PR, also if this is done, do you sign off the air for fueling, particularly during a response? Tim
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Medic21
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Saving the world, One life at a time
Posts: 16
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Post by Medic21 on Oct 5, 2003 10:42:43 GMT -5
I would hope that none of us would stop for fuel while "enroute to a call" fuel is just like any other piece of equipment we carry ie if I am out of IV fluids my truck is OOS until that equipment is replaced, Now as for takin a squirt, It seems that my bladder goes into spasm as soon as the tones drop because I never know when I will get to the bathroom next. My friend Matt Russell may be able to poop at a pt's house but I cannot ;D So I'll bet that on occasion we all take a squirt while enroute to our truck. I remember while growing up My Dept. would get a call at 3 AM and my dad would head straight to the bathroom and I would be in his truck waiting for him. When he finally came out I'd say why do you do that and his reply was when you get older you'll see, WELL NOW I SEE
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Post by 911guy on Oct 5, 2003 10:53:29 GMT -5
Well, why I see the rationale behind my peers logic (moving to the truck = responding), I cannot personally agree with it. To me, responding means that the physical piece of apparatus is in gear and under motion. I know of more than one occasion when an ALS unit has called responding, only to have the crew emerge from the hospital/base and discover the unit is dead or gone for various reasons. Then, fullly red-faced, a differenct unit calls enroute under the premise that the one they originally called enroute in had mechanical difficulty. Now I also know that units HAVE actually moved enroute under their own power and then died shortly afterwards - that happens. In the end, I still think that something is fundementally wrong with a system that relies on numbers that look good versus just announcing what is ACTUALLY happening. Did any of you read the weeklong report in USA Today recently that cited one of the big problems nationwide with EMS is the inaccurate and inconsistent practice of reporting scene times? I don't care, as long as the patient/incident stays the focus and concern, and not statistics.
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Post by 2Truck on Oct 13, 2003 22:50:41 GMT -5
Like 911Guy said what happens if you put the rig responding off of a portable and then it doesn't start? Talk about a major screw up! If it takes you two dispatches to get out then so be it, at least you are there to answer the call. Although if it is a paid EMS service then there is something wrong. If they can't get off their @$$ and get the rig started and on the road in 2 minutes then something needs to be looked at in the way that they are running.
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Medic21
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Saving the world, One life at a time
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Post by Medic21 on Oct 14, 2003 9:58:26 GMT -5
While I agree with some of the statments posted, I disagree with others and feel that a little education may be needed here regarding the paid services, 1. During daylight hours we have other duties around our station that may require some clean up before responding ie mowing the lawn or weed trimming. 2. As for my service if one truck dosen't start I have 7 more to try (I bet one of them will start) 3. Many of us work 24 hour shifts and sleep at night and it takes a few minutes to take a squirt and get dressed. 4. We are usually fully staffed and have no need to wait for additional crew, If we are not fully staffed, The truck does not get called enroute When we are dispatched, As 23Truck said, we "get off our @$$" and migrate toward our truck, Is this not responding? , I think it is, We are physically responding to a dispatch, The truck does not have to be in drive to constitute responding. As for volunteer agencies I agree with you whole heartedly, Because if the truck calls enroute before fully staffed some responders who are enroute to the station from their home on their own time may decide to turn around and go home.
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Post by Matt Russell on Oct 14, 2003 12:32:42 GMT -5
AMEN, BROTHER!
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Post by 911wacker on Oct 16, 2003 21:30:45 GMT -5
Anyway if we all drove like Western 16 we could make up the 1-2 minutes it took us to get to the ambulance!!
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3unit2
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Posts: 24
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Post by 3unit2 on Oct 17, 2003 16:29:14 GMT -5
"When we are dispatched, As 23Truck said, we "get off our @$$" and migrate toward our truck, Is this not responding? , I think it is, We are physically responding to a dispatch, The truck does not have to be in drive to constitute responding." (Medic21 post)
I DON'T THINK SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Example to Follow,and I have seen this to happen).... MICU (x) gets dispatched and is "responding" seconds after the call from this location.........
I have been in the area when the dispatch goes out, and 10 minutes later when I go by that same location MICU (x) is just now leaving the same spot they said they were responding from 10 minutes ago.....
Does this mean they had to wait for crew,go potty, finish their coffee,mow the lawn, restock the truck or what?
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Medic21
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Saving the world, One life at a time
Posts: 16
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Post by Medic21 on Oct 17, 2003 21:20:56 GMT -5
OK, I'll give you that one.. 10 minutes is extreme and unacceptable, I was writing under the ASSumption that the responding crew is able to use good common sense, The bottom line here boys and girls is as I said before if we, the MICU x crew are "Responding" to our truck and able to do so in a timely fasion ie 2-4 minutes We ARE in fact responding and that is usually in less time than it takes a non paid unit to crew and respond, (that is not a slam, Remember I volunteer also!)
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Post by flash97 on Dec 26, 2003 21:31:34 GMT -5
I think that the the welfare of the patient in need has been lost somewhere in the red tape, I believe that you should not radio in that your responding until your in your rig, unless you are responding directly to the scene in yuour personal vehicle. Screw the red tape and games for response times, if everyone would do it "right", there wouldn't be that much difference, raspberries to the powers that be that make us all "liars" so that it looks good on paper!
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